Difference between revisions of "CNM Tech Board 2023-05-02"

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[[CNM Technology Board 2023-5-2]] - is the [[CNM Technology Board‎]] event on 2 May.
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[[CNM Tech Board 2023-05-02]] is the meeting of [[CNM Technology Board‎]] that occurred on May 2nd, 2023. [[CNM Tech Board 2023-04-26]] is the predecessor event; [[CNM Tech Board 2023-05-10]] is the successor event.
  
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[[CNM Technology Board 2023-4-26]] is the predecessor event.
 
  
 
==Meeting subject==
 
==Meeting subject==
 +
:We were testing the possibility of streaming with [[Jitsi]] and [[Youtube]] and discussing the possibility of adding a streaming feature to [[Educaship Jitsi]] instances and using [[Avideo]] instead of YouTube. We also discussed our [[Educaship Jitsi#Challenges|CNM Jitsi challenges]] and potential contractors who responded to the proposal on Upwork and decided that we would hold meetings with experts but not give access to our CNM Jitsi until we hire them.
 +
:'''Result''' of the meeting: an [[CNMCyber event#How to Stream|instruction]] for streaming.
  
 +
== Video ==
 +
:https://youtu.be/rGLcVQ2pyKQ
 +
 +
==Script==
 +
We're like, what do we have going on, I mean where are we on Jitsi, on people? I mean again, I would like to take someone already and let the person work, and we're already there to look further and learn more. And also Sonya said that many are asking, I quickly looked that many are asking for access, which for me is not really, you can theoretically, Natalia can do a VM, but what will that access give them, yes that is for what, to see? Did we put Jitsi right or didn't we put it right. Well we need a solution, if we're talking about the balancer And generally all sorts of cluster build yes, it's a different task, who cares what it is now, we need to see what we want to do, not what is there.
 +
 +
That's what I think, most likely too, that they want to see exactly what's really there and try it out with their hands. I've noticed that for a lot of these contractors usually, I mean, if the customer gives us access to something, then we're already going the right way.
 +
 +
For them, it might just be like...
 +
 +
the money's coming in, we're closer to the money. Well, yes. Okay, please show us what we've got, this is going live, can we watch this live broadcast?
 +
 +
This is to try what we want. It's on YouTube right now, I think it's on.
 +
 +
will you teach me then how, I mean they, YouTube asked me what kind of video conference you use there and I didn't know what to tell me, I mean I should just point like
 +
Jitsi and that's it, right? No, no, no, it's the other way around. Yeah, I didn't specify anything on YouTube, I just clicked
 +
 +
create a broadcast, then they gave me a broadcast key, I went into Jitsi, there's also a "start broadcast" function and you have to enter that key.
 +
 +
Yes, that's what I need, and let's do it, let's try it anyway: that is, the more different these things, the better, and it will turn out that we'll sort of start new people already, send them to Stream and they will ask questions, but they won't participate.
 +
 +
Well okay, that's cool, that we're going somewhere that's good. Will you show it, yeah, can I see it? I wonder what it looks like. I'll send you the link, tell me if it's her or not, because I do not understand a little. Oh, exactly how do you send the link? Yeah, that's the link. Oh, I see.
 +
 +
It turns out that on YouTube, when the broadcast is over, it will be immediately saved to YouTube, that is already as a variant of the recording is obtained.
 +
 +
I've got "waiting for user mix."
 +
 +
and if you click on it, then yes
 +
 +
Show me, maybe it's on the screen? maybe it's just a link to the video should be? there's a "share". I'll try to show it now.
 +
 +
I can see it now.
 +
 +
Here it says "live", here it comes our image,
 +
 +
the connection is good, here you can finish the broadcast. That's pretty cool. And if you right-click, is there any way to share the link, so that it's a normal link? Because this one here, it's kind of different, yeah.
 +
 +
I saw where to share, but I can't find
 +
 +
There's some links, I copied that one.
 +
 +
yeah, yeah I looked, but I started echoing, so...
 +
 +
Shutting down
 +
 +
I cut Sonya [laughs]
 +
 +
Well cool yeah yeah cool
 +
 +
I'll write a tutorial later on how to do the stream.
 +
 +
and we had to wait 24 hours
 +
 +
We only had to wait 24 hours the first time, I already waited 24 hours.
 +
 +
That's what we looked then, that we have on our copies of Jitsi and it turns out there to start, we just wanted to feel exactly how it happens
 +
 +
what you're doing, you're doing it right.
 +
 +
And it turns out that not all of our Jitsi copies have the "live broadcast" function; in order to do so, we need to add this function.
 +
 +
This is also an additional question for our contractors.
 +
 +
So you're saying, except for today, yesterday was fine?
 +
 +
well with mine it's hard for me to judge because I can't see how it goes, I mean I did so, I made two laptops, on one I made one wifi, on the other one the other and I tried to watch periodically as the quality is so Well so more or less normal, but it worked already in principle well stable enough. But I can't really judge, like, what the quality was like for other people, because I kind of, like, well I heard people who were talking good quality
 +
 +
Google Meet was better quality because then we switched to Google Meet, Google Meet was better quality
 +
 +
Why did you switch? Because you're getting bogged down.
 +
 +
Oh, today? Yeah, I'm the one who switched to today.
 +
 +
but we need to work, I mean we're going in the right direction, we just need to finish it already, so that it went absolutely stable cool and put and God willing we are someone.... And on which one, Sonya have you already given Natalya someone or what?
 +
 +
No, that's what I wanted to talk to you about today.
 +
 +
I think I look at this thing and I do not see, I see some candidates and sometimes some ads, but I think I do not see any correspondence.
 +
 +
The one that asks for correspondence - you have to enter the chat room. That is, you see there enter into chat? That is, it will not show you right away and you need to enter the chat in my case is like this.
 +
 +
I do not see it for some reason, I am looking, now I show my screen
 +
 +
So so so a demonstration
 +
 +
here's the Jitsi ones we're on now, they work more confidently than Google Meet for me.
 +
 +
And so what you get is let's say "expert needed," here's the message
 +
 +
Here and
 +
 +
click on someone.
 +
 +
Here I was sort of corresponding with Theodore.
 +
 +
Here and so you're having a normal chat
 +
 +
But where exactly do you see them, all the candidates? I don't understand.
 +
 +
There are five candidates, here are all invitations. I invited eight more no one... They are only five, which is very little, but how much is there, because I put on a temporary it, but you can try to invite them more, as it were. That is, you can basically try to invite here, you can still separately make an account at freelancer.ua and look specifically let's say in Ukraine.
 +
 +
Ah, unanswered invitation, because I thought their large number, I think where they went all.
 +
 +
No, no, there's a small number of them, there's as many as you have, you see everything, it's okay.
 +
 +
This one doesn't answer from Latvia.
 +
 +
Well, they won't answer.
 +
 +
There are always sort of people who click and then they have something change or something
 +
 +
Natalia, have you looked at Jitsi?
 +
 +
I haven't looked at anything, Natalya.
 +
 +
Yes, interesting offers there of course, and on these, on MediaWiki there are some models of Zoha, which is something else.
 +
 +
MediaWiki I think to remake PHP announcement, look for someone already, that is, we will take someone now well as a temporary, in general, look for I think it's easier specialists in PHP, and who know PHP, they have MediaWiki to deal with
 +
 +
Here's PHP, LDAP, I'm sure someone who knows that would solve the problem.
 +
 +
Can I say that this is the version that today found how to sign, how to collect everything, because to sign instead of Jitsi another word turns out to be such a mess, that's where let's say you write the same word in five files in different places. But so far it's not critical, as long as it works, so it works, we have to find it to work steadily, then we will decorate it, bring beauty [laughter] only if it works, only if it stands only if there could live conferences and do everything else
 +
 +
With the streamer it worked at least we saw how it should be.
 +
 +
This is good. This is good progress. I like this progress.
 +
 +
so good, what else did we have there today? Well, in general, I wanted to make such a topic "our products for web conferencing" to talk a little about what we have, but I also wanted to talk about candidates today, but in principle, I just personally don’t know what to ask them, It seems to me that they should already be given to Natalya, there are only 5 of them.
 +
 +
Well, I’m not all of them good, or they are all, that is, you wrote something to me there, but I honestly say so.
 +
 +
Only one said that he could solve only one of all the problems and wrote a little, and all the rest wrote quite a lot, saying "yes, I understand this, I can do it, let's call"
 +
 +
Let's call up, because again for us to find a person is one problem,
 +
 +
but to discuss with someone and just hear what people say, what people want - this is another task and we can find a solution to problems without even hiring a person, just by interviewing
 +
 +
For us, for me, this is one of such big tasks - to find an architecture, how best we can put our Jitsi in such a way that they work consistently with high quality so that we are not ashamed of them so that at least nothing falls and we can start the conference and complete the conference, this is the main task. How to put it, where to put it - that's another question, now it costs, as I understand it, in Germany, Contabo server
 +
 +
Yes, yes it's on 106
  
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== Video ==
+
Well, now the quality is good on my part, the sound is cool, and not we are now on Jitsi on theirs, not on ours.
 +
 
 +
Well, in general, they have large loads, we should not have worse quality than theirs
 +
 
 +
Well, it used to be better, before we compared it with Misha, we compared both with this one with a zoom, so we compared with Jitsi, as it were, with their server, on which we are now. Ours then, which stood at that time, in my opinion it was on the digital ocean, I could be wrong, maybe yes, maybe on contabo, I don’t remember already, in principle, we already use contabo for a couple of years, maybe contabo, it was more until not it was just covid yes it was the beginning of the year that is. Well, yes, apparently she was on contabo and then the quality of ours was better than Jitsi, as it were, native, because yes, but Jitsi they also most likely increased their resources, they increased the frequency of processors, added, they also do not stand still
 +
 
 +
decide for yourself with people, you and Natalya decide for yourself who you take
 +
 
 +
we don’t have to immediately take him or her for, I don’t know, for life, we can take it there for 5 hours and see how it will be.
 +
 
 +
Well, yes. And if you arrange meetings with them, then you are all together?
 +
 
 +
Yes, also for two hours, let's say the time suits me, two hours suits me
 +
 
 +
Okay, then I'll deal with someone.
 +
 
 +
Negotiate. And from others it is necessary to slowly pull information from others and on their wiki
 +
 
 +
on the wiki, as it were, and
 +
 
 +
let's go let's go let's go until our wikis are on the farm, which is on the hetzner, I think that we need to start from the other side, we need to look for Muhammad and look at our cluster first,
 +
 
 +
what's wrong with him
 +
 
 +
since such a problem, there is something we do not have a Jitsi problem there, this is our proxmox problem. Firstly, firstly, these machines, that is, well, that is, they do not work as slowly, not only very slowly, as you used to, but how I would like it to be better anyway.
 +
 
 +
I think I don’t know how I feel, I’m quite possibly mistaken, but it seems to me that we need to do this kind of cluster separately on Jitsi and do everything on contaba on digital ocean and on the hetzner part and the one on the hetzner, we need to put on the third machine, which is 128 GHz, which is fast, which is powerful, because there is no SSD, but for Jitsi SSD is not needed at all, in principle, because there are no databases, you do not need to make a request to the disk. So it should, but if we put it there simply as one, it must fly, it must simply fly, it must fly like an airplane. Contabo and digital ocean, for example, they will be in reserve for us if something is not right there. I think so, but we will find some option in any case with someone we will find an option and with a consultant it will be even faster.
 +
 
 +
Then, Sonya, we can try together exactly there, let's say there you can go into the room for several people
 +
 
 +
Chat? I don't know by the way, I hope so
 +
 
 +
Yes, I'm also interested
 +
 
 +
Organize, by the way
 +
 
 +
Sonya, where does she not let you in there and what does she write there? and you send me.
 +
 
 +
Well, yes, I sent you a screenshot by mail, but I just updated it again and everything was fine, I don’t know what it was,
 +
 
 +
but it wrote to me that in order to continue the chat I must have a verified payment method
 +
 
 +
Well, I already wrote a couple of messages there. Then I go in, she writes to me like that, and now I go in again and that's it, and the chat returned back to what it was. They make mistakes, if we talk about their technological upwork, this one they have a lot of them and, as it were, something else is not available, they very often have technical problems, so I think that this is some kind of just a grinch if it repeats then this one
 +
 
 +
maybe from the fact that I went in, that is, the principle from the moment I was told to the moment that's how everything turned out for you I did only one thing I went there and left
 +
 
 +
maybe because I went in, they somehow updated everything there. Or maybe they just have some kind of trouble. They often write often there, let’s say we’re not available today, that is, they have technical problems, especially as they had the first time they had at all that the site was not working
 +
 
 +
when they merged it was oDesk and Elance when they first merged there for weeks they could not work
 +
 
 +
strange, they could hire some kind of expert. Yes, they are there and they are sitting on experts, they could
 +
 
 +
Well, then interview, choose if you need something from me, well, let me be here, and if you already start meetings, that is, we need specific questions for the meetings, somehow prepare for them, so that it didn't work out there
 +
 
 +
at some point it will turn out that I need to talk and organize everything, as it was before. If you produce everything, in principle, Carolina, well, there was something to work on, but in general, at least she did something that would be, what to expect, respectively, from these people too. If they make some kind of virtual machine, we are in an interview, Natalya, how are we, we can do something, we can basically come to us, right, without giving them access, but just on the screen, as I understand it? Well, in general, they have large loads, we should not have worse quality than theirs
 +
 
 +
Well, it used to be better, before we compared it with Misha, we compared both with this one with a zoom, so we compared with Jitsi, as it were, with their server, on which we are now. Ours then, which stood at that time, in my opinion, it was on the digital ocean, I could be wrong, maybe yes, maybe on contabo, I don’t remember already, in principle, we already use contabo for a couple of years, maybe contabo, it was more until not it was just covid yes it was the beginning of the year that is. Well, yes, apparently she was on contabo and then the quality of ours was better than Jitsi, as it were, native, because yes, but Jitsi they also most likely increased their resources, they increased the frequency of processors, added, they also do not stand still
 +
 
 +
decide for yourself with people, you and Natalya decide for yourself who you take
 +
 
 +
we don’t have to immediately take him or her for, I don’t know, for life, we can take it there for 5 hours and see how it will be.
 +
 
 +
Well, yes. And if you arrange meetings with them, then you are all together?
 +
 
 +
Yes, also for two hours, let's say the time suits me, two hours suits me
 +
 
 +
Okay, then I'll deal with someone.
 +
 
 +
Negotiate. And from others it is necessary to slowly pull information from others and on their wiki
 +
 
 +
on the wiki, as it were, and
 +
 
 +
let's go let's go let's go until our wikis are on the farm, which is on the hetzner, I think that we need to start from the other side, we need to look for Muhammad and look at our cluster first,
 +
 
 +
what's wrong with him
 +
 
 +
since such a problem, there is something we do not have a Jitsi problem there, this is our proxmox problem. Firstly, firstly, these machines, that is, well, that is, they do not work as slowly, not only very slowly, as you used to, but how I would like it to be better anyway.
 +
 
 +
I think I don’t know how I feel, I’m quite possibly mistaken, but it seems to me that we need to do this kind of cluster separately on Jitsi and do everything on contabo on digital ocean and on the hetzner part and the one on the hetzner, we need to put on the third machine, which is 128 GHz, which is fast, which is powerful, because there is no SSD, but for Jitsi SSD is not needed at all, in principle, because there are no databases, you do not need to make a request to the disk. So it should, but if we put it there simply as one, it must fly, it must simply fly, it must fly like an airplane. Contabo and digital ocean, for example, will be in reserve for us if something is not right there. I think so, but we will find some option in any case with someone we will find an option and with a consultant it will be even faster.
 +
 
 +
Then, Sonya, we can try together exactly there, let's say there you can go into the room for several people
 +
 
 +
Chat? I don't know by the way, I hope so
 +
 
 +
Yes, I'm also interested
 +
 
 +
Organize, by the way
 +
 
 +
Sonya, where does she not let you in there and what does she write there? and you send me.
 +
 
 +
Well, yes, I sent you a screenshot by mail, but I just updated it again and everything was fine, I don’t know what it was,
 +
 
 +
but it wrote to me that in order to continue the chat I must have a verified payment method
 +
 
 +
Well, I already wrote a couple of messages there. Then I go in, she writes to me like that, and now I go in again and that's it, and the chat returned back to what it was. They make mistakes, if we talk about their technological upwork, this one they have a lot of them and, as it were, something else is not available, they very often have technical problems, so I think that this is some kind of just a grinch if it repeats then this one
 +
 
 +
maybe from the fact that I went in, that is, the principle from the moment I was told to the moment that's how everything turned out for you I did only one thing I went there and left
 +
 
 +
maybe because I went in, they somehow updated everything there. Or maybe they just have some kind of trouble. They often write often there, let’s say we’re not available today, that is, they have technical problems, especially as they had the first time they had at all that the site was not working
 +
 
 +
when they merged it was oDesk and Elance when they first merged there for weeks they could not work
 +
 
 +
strange, they could hire some kind of expert. Yes, they are there and they are sitting on experts, they could
 +
 
 +
Well, then interview, choose if you need something from me, well, let me be here, and if you already start meetings, that is, we need specific questions for the meetings, somehow prepare for them, so that it didn't work out there
 +
 
 +
at some point, it will turn out that I need to talk and organize everything, as it was before. If you produce everything, in principle, Carolina, well, there was something to work on, but in general, at least she did something that would be, what to expect, respectively, from these people too. If they make some kind of virtual machine, we are in an interview, Natalya, how are we, we can do something, we can basically come to us, right, without giving them access, but just on the screen, as I understand it?
 +
 
 +
On the screen like some kind of application or just a screen? just a screen. Why does he let them in to us or is it necessary? If necessary - let's let it go, if not necessary - why do we need this headache
 +
 
 +
you will do VMs.
 +
 
 +
If they want to show something specifically, because we, too, are not eager to show something strongly there, then one thing. In general, I think so the very idea when a specialist works remotely and does not have the opportunity to do something with his hands there, well, personally, it was inconvenient for me. Well let's do let's give something
 +
 
 +
Let's ask those specifically who wanted access, ask what exactly they want, what exactly to show them, maybe then. We also need to establish this system, how we do it all and how we conduct it, and this is not the last interview, not the last expert we are looking for. And how we fix this system, then ... well, my battery is running out.
 +
 
 +
need to charge
 +
 
 +
But my camera doesn't work, right? I do not see you
 +
 
 +
for some reason, when I'm streaming, the camera worked there for a couple of minutes and that's it and me ...
 +
 
 +
Is it on the stream? Well, if I'm streaming in Jitsi, then for some reason the camera does not turn on.
 +
 
 +
Why isn't this the first time? I thought we were trying to stream for the first time.
 +
 
 +
Well, I just tried it today, I tested it. And the camera button is not working.
 +
 
 +
I love this recording bot.
 +
 
 +
You did this on the VM, how is it all organized?
 +
 
 +
In general, now I launched a live broadcast at my place,
 +
 
 +
and not on the VM, because there you need to go to your Google account in order to go to YouTube, but you can then do it there, but now I just turned on Jitsi there and, just in case, suddenly something happened with the broadcast, turned on the recording on OBS.
 +
 
 +
that is, OBS is there and you turned it on?
 +
 
 +
I see, but your feeling of being a virtual machine is a bit slow, right? Well, as soon as I turn on OBS, it immediately starts to slow down. Ah, right from the load yes.
 +
 
 +
And if you just climb, then it's fine.
 +
 
 +
Then I think it can really add resources
 +
 
 +
I also think you can broadcast with it, you just need to go to your account and connect our channel.
 +
 
 +
Well, well, well
 +
 
 +
Kevin contacted you, Natalia? For some reason, no. And what is he waiting for, here are the media wikis for us, it’s even more urgent for us, because we get people can’t start working without a mediawiki
 +
 
 +
let's see what he says tomorrow, meeting tomorrow
 +
 
 +
okay, but of course, once again, if we talk about people, we need to interview more people, that is, this is part of the job. The more we recruit, even we will make one, we can call others and ask what we have, say something, and for this, the actual idea is how such a person would show documentation if a person said something smart then we let him in there on the VM
 +
 
 +
if a person didn’t say anything smart according to the documentation, then, in principle, why let it go to the VM
 +
 
 +
Well, yes, it is logical. I think so, well, Natalia feels better
 +
 
 +
documentation is a good thing anyway. What else, everyone, let's have a short meeting?
 +
 
 +
I wanted to maybe talk a little bit about other ways we can stream, now we're trying through YouTube.
 +
 
 +
We have this Avideo, I thought for myself to make this bundle: Avideo, Jitsi, OBS all together and then we get that it sort of comes from several sides, it works stably, it sort of stands on several legs, the chair is not on one leg, but on several, if we did that, it would be cool. Avideo is a separate topic and it is also relevant.
 +
 
 +
That is, I think we just need to make the problem more specific, that is, we have now seen that the main function is performed by Jitsi, it is this function that should be configured in Jitsi
 +
 
 +
then we go let’s say Jitsi and YouTube here, and then we try from YouTube and then we go to Avideo
 +
 
 +
Yes, normal plan, yes, okay
 +
 
 +
In addition to Avideo, many more similar software appeared, I saw that when we chose, we chose Avideo - they were in php and they were, so we liked them that they were in php. But at that time there were no special competitors, now I have looked at a lot of applications. That is, if Avideo doesn’t work for us, we can try someone else, but this is naturally the next stage, it’s not at this stage, at this stage we at least need a kind of stable conference at least on Jitsi.
 +
 
 +
And what have you heard of an interesting application. I don't remember, I usually go to this AlternativeTo I like this resource
 +
 
 +
that is, they basically have this Kanter or how she is there, she also compares something. But this is what I usually use.
 +
 
 +
I'm in the chat right now
 +
 
 +
They give, as it were, you can immediately choose open source
 +
 
 +
[music]
 +
 
 +
Yes
 +
 
 +
they are still here under the old name. maybe they are not new, and well, in principle, it is, as it were, historically, and the video is now they are doing the rebranding themselves, but historically they were called YouPHPTube stably.
 +
 
 +
I choose allow
 +
 
 +
it turns out even vimeo, does it turn out similar?
 +
 
 +
Well, yes, but they all have their own characteristics
 +
 
 +
there is one peertube they have generally interesting ideas they
 +
 
 +
on several, that is, they are, as it were, on several independent networks, and it turns out that they are, as it were, well, an interesting idea
 +
 
 +
this is the principle at the moment, but you can choose to take let's say who to look for and we can choose, for example, only Open Source, for example
 +
 
 +
now I'm sharing
 +
 
 +
Already exactly, as it were, well, that is, with a choice
 +
 
 +
and you can choose let's say only there PHP there or something else
 +
 
 +
and accordingly, now they give only those that are Open Source
 +
 
 +
media Goblin someone praised me, but it's a long time ago, but they don't have as many as these.
 +
 
 +
I will directly write down, to be honest, I have not heard such a wonderful resource.
 +
 
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AlternativeTo?
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This is my main
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I think the conference will end now, I'll lose the link, don't
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I look at this BuiltWith, for example, they give me statistics and how much physically now, well, that is, I use Google Trends, I see how often people ask something, by the number exactly how much this BuiltWith costs, they show how many percentage of sites they use they are, well, judging by their popularity
 +
 
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Well, yes, and I use AlternativeTo to search for options
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so I want to ask if we can make Avideo the topic of conversation there for the next meeting, or until we solve all the problems with Jitsi, how would we leave this topic? If you organize, if you coordinate a meeting of our council, then you decide, in principle, you can ask Natalia or me, but there must be some kind of agenda,
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you are preparing a meeting of a technical council or a technology council, as we called it, a technology council and, accordingly, the topics can be any topical ones that we will consider. Then, after some time, of course, we will arrange our applications, we will periodically do them as a periodic review as an inspection inspection review Well, yes, a review.
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and but I don’t know the topics at the moment, any topics, everything related to technology, at the moment we have two very hot problems - these are Jitsi with video, not even Jitsi, but let's call it video conferences, starting with Jitsi and the second is mediawiki starting with LDAP. But in general, we have a lot of problems, in general we have a lot of problems, there are a lot of problems Oplet, with LDAP we want to jump out to wso2
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We need to look at our cluster that Muhammad did,
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also urgent by the way, three urgent issues, because the cluster is about Jitsi
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But we haven’t talked about wikis in principle yet, we can start a series about wikis
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You talk about the Guided Tour, it's gone, finished
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Guided Tour, we made a prototype, the prototype suits me, I like it, but we didn’t find an option how to translate it into English, if we don’t have working options for translating it into English, we can’t sell it, then we need to do something else, that is, here at the moment for me the Guided Tour is just kind of okay
  
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a stopped project, that is, we tried it, we got it, we liked the prototype, but the question is how to move it further how to do it
  
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[[CNM Technology Board 2023-5-10]] is the successor event.
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like this Well, what else is there a topic or so it's normal, calmly, well, in a family way. I like this option. Then it turns out that these meetings will be, the main goal is to discuss current problems, current technical problems, what we do where we want projects to move.
  
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[[Category:CNM Technology Board‎]]
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[[Category:CNM Tech Board Meetings‎]]

Latest revision as of 16:43, 14 April 2024

CNM Tech Board 2023-05-02 is the meeting of CNM Technology Board‎ that occurred on May 2nd, 2023. CNM Tech Board 2023-04-26 is the predecessor event; CNM Tech Board 2023-05-10 is the successor event.


Meeting subject

We were testing the possibility of streaming with Jitsi and Youtube and discussing the possibility of adding a streaming feature to Educaship Jitsi instances and using Avideo instead of YouTube. We also discussed our CNM Jitsi challenges and potential contractors who responded to the proposal on Upwork and decided that we would hold meetings with experts but not give access to our CNM Jitsi until we hire them.
Result of the meeting: an instruction for streaming.

Video

https://youtu.be/rGLcVQ2pyKQ

Script

We're like, what do we have going on, I mean where are we on Jitsi, on people? I mean again, I would like to take someone already and let the person work, and we're already there to look further and learn more. And also Sonya said that many are asking, I quickly looked that many are asking for access, which for me is not really, you can theoretically, Natalia can do a VM, but what will that access give them, yes that is for what, to see? Did we put Jitsi right or didn't we put it right. Well we need a solution, if we're talking about the balancer And generally all sorts of cluster build yes, it's a different task, who cares what it is now, we need to see what we want to do, not what is there.

That's what I think, most likely too, that they want to see exactly what's really there and try it out with their hands. I've noticed that for a lot of these contractors usually, I mean, if the customer gives us access to something, then we're already going the right way.

For them, it might just be like...

the money's coming in, we're closer to the money. Well, yes. Okay, please show us what we've got, this is going live, can we watch this live broadcast?

This is to try what we want. It's on YouTube right now, I think it's on.

will you teach me then how, I mean they, YouTube asked me what kind of video conference you use there and I didn't know what to tell me, I mean I should just point like Jitsi and that's it, right? No, no, no, it's the other way around. Yeah, I didn't specify anything on YouTube, I just clicked

create a broadcast, then they gave me a broadcast key, I went into Jitsi, there's also a "start broadcast" function and you have to enter that key.

Yes, that's what I need, and let's do it, let's try it anyway: that is, the more different these things, the better, and it will turn out that we'll sort of start new people already, send them to Stream and they will ask questions, but they won't participate.

Well okay, that's cool, that we're going somewhere that's good. Will you show it, yeah, can I see it? I wonder what it looks like. I'll send you the link, tell me if it's her or not, because I do not understand a little. Oh, exactly how do you send the link? Yeah, that's the link. Oh, I see.

It turns out that on YouTube, when the broadcast is over, it will be immediately saved to YouTube, that is already as a variant of the recording is obtained.

I've got "waiting for user mix."

and if you click on it, then yes

Show me, maybe it's on the screen? maybe it's just a link to the video should be? there's a "share". I'll try to show it now.

I can see it now.

Here it says "live", here it comes our image,

the connection is good, here you can finish the broadcast. That's pretty cool. And if you right-click, is there any way to share the link, so that it's a normal link? Because this one here, it's kind of different, yeah.

I saw where to share, but I can't find

There's some links, I copied that one.

yeah, yeah I looked, but I started echoing, so...

Shutting down

I cut Sonya [laughs]

Well cool yeah yeah cool

I'll write a tutorial later on how to do the stream.

and we had to wait 24 hours

We only had to wait 24 hours the first time, I already waited 24 hours.

That's what we looked then, that we have on our copies of Jitsi and it turns out there to start, we just wanted to feel exactly how it happens

what you're doing, you're doing it right.

And it turns out that not all of our Jitsi copies have the "live broadcast" function; in order to do so, we need to add this function.

This is also an additional question for our contractors.

So you're saying, except for today, yesterday was fine?

well with mine it's hard for me to judge because I can't see how it goes, I mean I did so, I made two laptops, on one I made one wifi, on the other one the other and I tried to watch periodically as the quality is so Well so more or less normal, but it worked already in principle well stable enough. But I can't really judge, like, what the quality was like for other people, because I kind of, like, well I heard people who were talking good quality

Google Meet was better quality because then we switched to Google Meet, Google Meet was better quality

Why did you switch? Because you're getting bogged down.

Oh, today? Yeah, I'm the one who switched to today.

but we need to work, I mean we're going in the right direction, we just need to finish it already, so that it went absolutely stable cool and put and God willing we are someone.... And on which one, Sonya have you already given Natalya someone or what?

No, that's what I wanted to talk to you about today.

I think I look at this thing and I do not see, I see some candidates and sometimes some ads, but I think I do not see any correspondence.

The one that asks for correspondence - you have to enter the chat room. That is, you see there enter into chat? That is, it will not show you right away and you need to enter the chat in my case is like this.

I do not see it for some reason, I am looking, now I show my screen

So so so a demonstration

here's the Jitsi ones we're on now, they work more confidently than Google Meet for me.

And so what you get is let's say "expert needed," here's the message

Here and

click on someone.

Here I was sort of corresponding with Theodore.

Here and so you're having a normal chat

But where exactly do you see them, all the candidates? I don't understand.

There are five candidates, here are all invitations. I invited eight more no one... They are only five, which is very little, but how much is there, because I put on a temporary it, but you can try to invite them more, as it were. That is, you can basically try to invite here, you can still separately make an account at freelancer.ua and look specifically let's say in Ukraine.

Ah, unanswered invitation, because I thought their large number, I think where they went all.

No, no, there's a small number of them, there's as many as you have, you see everything, it's okay.

This one doesn't answer from Latvia.

Well, they won't answer.

There are always sort of people who click and then they have something change or something

Natalia, have you looked at Jitsi?

I haven't looked at anything, Natalya.

Yes, interesting offers there of course, and on these, on MediaWiki there are some models of Zoha, which is something else.

MediaWiki I think to remake PHP announcement, look for someone already, that is, we will take someone now well as a temporary, in general, look for I think it's easier specialists in PHP, and who know PHP, they have MediaWiki to deal with

Here's PHP, LDAP, I'm sure someone who knows that would solve the problem.

Can I say that this is the version that today found how to sign, how to collect everything, because to sign instead of Jitsi another word turns out to be such a mess, that's where let's say you write the same word in five files in different places. But so far it's not critical, as long as it works, so it works, we have to find it to work steadily, then we will decorate it, bring beauty [laughter] only if it works, only if it stands only if there could live conferences and do everything else

With the streamer it worked at least we saw how it should be.

This is good. This is good progress. I like this progress.

so good, what else did we have there today? Well, in general, I wanted to make such a topic "our products for web conferencing" to talk a little about what we have, but I also wanted to talk about candidates today, but in principle, I just personally don’t know what to ask them, It seems to me that they should already be given to Natalya, there are only 5 of them.

Well, I’m not all of them good, or they are all, that is, you wrote something to me there, but I honestly say so.

Only one said that he could solve only one of all the problems and wrote a little, and all the rest wrote quite a lot, saying "yes, I understand this, I can do it, let's call"

Let's call up, because again for us to find a person is one problem,

but to discuss with someone and just hear what people say, what people want - this is another task and we can find a solution to problems without even hiring a person, just by interviewing

For us, for me, this is one of such big tasks - to find an architecture, how best we can put our Jitsi in such a way that they work consistently with high quality so that we are not ashamed of them so that at least nothing falls and we can start the conference and complete the conference, this is the main task. How to put it, where to put it - that's another question, now it costs, as I understand it, in Germany, Contabo server

Yes, yes it's on 106

Well, now the quality is good on my part, the sound is cool, and not we are now on Jitsi on theirs, not on ours.

Well, in general, they have large loads, we should not have worse quality than theirs

Well, it used to be better, before we compared it with Misha, we compared both with this one with a zoom, so we compared with Jitsi, as it were, with their server, on which we are now. Ours then, which stood at that time, in my opinion it was on the digital ocean, I could be wrong, maybe yes, maybe on contabo, I don’t remember already, in principle, we already use contabo for a couple of years, maybe contabo, it was more until not it was just covid yes it was the beginning of the year that is. Well, yes, apparently she was on contabo and then the quality of ours was better than Jitsi, as it were, native, because yes, but Jitsi they also most likely increased their resources, they increased the frequency of processors, added, they also do not stand still

decide for yourself with people, you and Natalya decide for yourself who you take

we don’t have to immediately take him or her for, I don’t know, for life, we can take it there for 5 hours and see how it will be.

Well, yes. And if you arrange meetings with them, then you are all together?

Yes, also for two hours, let's say the time suits me, two hours suits me

Okay, then I'll deal with someone.

Negotiate. And from others it is necessary to slowly pull information from others and on their wiki

on the wiki, as it were, and

let's go let's go let's go until our wikis are on the farm, which is on the hetzner, I think that we need to start from the other side, we need to look for Muhammad and look at our cluster first,

what's wrong with him

since such a problem, there is something we do not have a Jitsi problem there, this is our proxmox problem. Firstly, firstly, these machines, that is, well, that is, they do not work as slowly, not only very slowly, as you used to, but how I would like it to be better anyway.

I think I don’t know how I feel, I’m quite possibly mistaken, but it seems to me that we need to do this kind of cluster separately on Jitsi and do everything on contaba on digital ocean and on the hetzner part and the one on the hetzner, we need to put on the third machine, which is 128 GHz, which is fast, which is powerful, because there is no SSD, but for Jitsi SSD is not needed at all, in principle, because there are no databases, you do not need to make a request to the disk. So it should, but if we put it there simply as one, it must fly, it must simply fly, it must fly like an airplane. Contabo and digital ocean, for example, they will be in reserve for us if something is not right there. I think so, but we will find some option in any case with someone we will find an option and with a consultant it will be even faster.

Then, Sonya, we can try together exactly there, let's say there you can go into the room for several people

Chat? I don't know by the way, I hope so

Yes, I'm also interested

Organize, by the way

Sonya, where does she not let you in there and what does she write there? and you send me.

Well, yes, I sent you a screenshot by mail, but I just updated it again and everything was fine, I don’t know what it was,

but it wrote to me that in order to continue the chat I must have a verified payment method

Well, I already wrote a couple of messages there. Then I go in, she writes to me like that, and now I go in again and that's it, and the chat returned back to what it was. They make mistakes, if we talk about their technological upwork, this one they have a lot of them and, as it were, something else is not available, they very often have technical problems, so I think that this is some kind of just a grinch if it repeats then this one

maybe from the fact that I went in, that is, the principle from the moment I was told to the moment that's how everything turned out for you I did only one thing I went there and left

maybe because I went in, they somehow updated everything there. Or maybe they just have some kind of trouble. They often write often there, let’s say we’re not available today, that is, they have technical problems, especially as they had the first time they had at all that the site was not working

when they merged it was oDesk and Elance when they first merged there for weeks they could not work

strange, they could hire some kind of expert. Yes, they are there and they are sitting on experts, they could

Well, then interview, choose if you need something from me, well, let me be here, and if you already start meetings, that is, we need specific questions for the meetings, somehow prepare for them, so that it didn't work out there

at some point it will turn out that I need to talk and organize everything, as it was before. If you produce everything, in principle, Carolina, well, there was something to work on, but in general, at least she did something that would be, what to expect, respectively, from these people too. If they make some kind of virtual machine, we are in an interview, Natalya, how are we, we can do something, we can basically come to us, right, without giving them access, but just on the screen, as I understand it? Well, in general, they have large loads, we should not have worse quality than theirs

Well, it used to be better, before we compared it with Misha, we compared both with this one with a zoom, so we compared with Jitsi, as it were, with their server, on which we are now. Ours then, which stood at that time, in my opinion, it was on the digital ocean, I could be wrong, maybe yes, maybe on contabo, I don’t remember already, in principle, we already use contabo for a couple of years, maybe contabo, it was more until not it was just covid yes it was the beginning of the year that is. Well, yes, apparently she was on contabo and then the quality of ours was better than Jitsi, as it were, native, because yes, but Jitsi they also most likely increased their resources, they increased the frequency of processors, added, they also do not stand still

decide for yourself with people, you and Natalya decide for yourself who you take

we don’t have to immediately take him or her for, I don’t know, for life, we can take it there for 5 hours and see how it will be.

Well, yes. And if you arrange meetings with them, then you are all together?

Yes, also for two hours, let's say the time suits me, two hours suits me

Okay, then I'll deal with someone.

Negotiate. And from others it is necessary to slowly pull information from others and on their wiki

on the wiki, as it were, and

let's go let's go let's go until our wikis are on the farm, which is on the hetzner, I think that we need to start from the other side, we need to look for Muhammad and look at our cluster first,

what's wrong with him

since such a problem, there is something we do not have a Jitsi problem there, this is our proxmox problem. Firstly, firstly, these machines, that is, well, that is, they do not work as slowly, not only very slowly, as you used to, but how I would like it to be better anyway.

I think I don’t know how I feel, I’m quite possibly mistaken, but it seems to me that we need to do this kind of cluster separately on Jitsi and do everything on contabo on digital ocean and on the hetzner part and the one on the hetzner, we need to put on the third machine, which is 128 GHz, which is fast, which is powerful, because there is no SSD, but for Jitsi SSD is not needed at all, in principle, because there are no databases, you do not need to make a request to the disk. So it should, but if we put it there simply as one, it must fly, it must simply fly, it must fly like an airplane. Contabo and digital ocean, for example, will be in reserve for us if something is not right there. I think so, but we will find some option in any case with someone we will find an option and with a consultant it will be even faster.

Then, Sonya, we can try together exactly there, let's say there you can go into the room for several people

Chat? I don't know by the way, I hope so

Yes, I'm also interested

Organize, by the way

Sonya, where does she not let you in there and what does she write there? and you send me.

Well, yes, I sent you a screenshot by mail, but I just updated it again and everything was fine, I don’t know what it was,

but it wrote to me that in order to continue the chat I must have a verified payment method

Well, I already wrote a couple of messages there. Then I go in, she writes to me like that, and now I go in again and that's it, and the chat returned back to what it was. They make mistakes, if we talk about their technological upwork, this one they have a lot of them and, as it were, something else is not available, they very often have technical problems, so I think that this is some kind of just a grinch if it repeats then this one

maybe from the fact that I went in, that is, the principle from the moment I was told to the moment that's how everything turned out for you I did only one thing I went there and left

maybe because I went in, they somehow updated everything there. Or maybe they just have some kind of trouble. They often write often there, let’s say we’re not available today, that is, they have technical problems, especially as they had the first time they had at all that the site was not working

when they merged it was oDesk and Elance when they first merged there for weeks they could not work

strange, they could hire some kind of expert. Yes, they are there and they are sitting on experts, they could

Well, then interview, choose if you need something from me, well, let me be here, and if you already start meetings, that is, we need specific questions for the meetings, somehow prepare for them, so that it didn't work out there

at some point, it will turn out that I need to talk and organize everything, as it was before. If you produce everything, in principle, Carolina, well, there was something to work on, but in general, at least she did something that would be, what to expect, respectively, from these people too. If they make some kind of virtual machine, we are in an interview, Natalya, how are we, we can do something, we can basically come to us, right, without giving them access, but just on the screen, as I understand it?

On the screen like some kind of application or just a screen? just a screen. Why does he let them in to us or is it necessary? If necessary - let's let it go, if not necessary - why do we need this headache

you will do VMs.

If they want to show something specifically, because we, too, are not eager to show something strongly there, then one thing. In general, I think so the very idea when a specialist works remotely and does not have the opportunity to do something with his hands there, well, personally, it was inconvenient for me. Well let's do let's give something

Let's ask those specifically who wanted access, ask what exactly they want, what exactly to show them, maybe then. We also need to establish this system, how we do it all and how we conduct it, and this is not the last interview, not the last expert we are looking for. And how we fix this system, then ... well, my battery is running out.

need to charge

But my camera doesn't work, right? I do not see you

for some reason, when I'm streaming, the camera worked there for a couple of minutes and that's it and me ...

Is it on the stream? Well, if I'm streaming in Jitsi, then for some reason the camera does not turn on.

Why isn't this the first time? I thought we were trying to stream for the first time.

Well, I just tried it today, I tested it. And the camera button is not working.

I love this recording bot.

You did this on the VM, how is it all organized?

In general, now I launched a live broadcast at my place,

and not on the VM, because there you need to go to your Google account in order to go to YouTube, but you can then do it there, but now I just turned on Jitsi there and, just in case, suddenly something happened with the broadcast, turned on the recording on OBS.

that is, OBS is there and you turned it on?

I see, but your feeling of being a virtual machine is a bit slow, right? Well, as soon as I turn on OBS, it immediately starts to slow down. Ah, right from the load yes.

And if you just climb, then it's fine.

Then I think it can really add resources

I also think you can broadcast with it, you just need to go to your account and connect our channel.

Well, well, well

Kevin contacted you, Natalia? For some reason, no. And what is he waiting for, here are the media wikis for us, it’s even more urgent for us, because we get people can’t start working without a mediawiki

let's see what he says tomorrow, meeting tomorrow

okay, but of course, once again, if we talk about people, we need to interview more people, that is, this is part of the job. The more we recruit, even we will make one, we can call others and ask what we have, say something, and for this, the actual idea is how such a person would show documentation if a person said something smart then we let him in there on the VM

if a person didn’t say anything smart according to the documentation, then, in principle, why let it go to the VM

Well, yes, it is logical. I think so, well, Natalia feels better

documentation is a good thing anyway. What else, everyone, let's have a short meeting?

I wanted to maybe talk a little bit about other ways we can stream, now we're trying through YouTube.

We have this Avideo, I thought for myself to make this bundle: Avideo, Jitsi, OBS all together and then we get that it sort of comes from several sides, it works stably, it sort of stands on several legs, the chair is not on one leg, but on several, if we did that, it would be cool. Avideo is a separate topic and it is also relevant.

That is, I think we just need to make the problem more specific, that is, we have now seen that the main function is performed by Jitsi, it is this function that should be configured in Jitsi

then we go let’s say Jitsi and YouTube here, and then we try from YouTube and then we go to Avideo

Yes, normal plan, yes, okay

In addition to Avideo, many more similar software appeared, I saw that when we chose, we chose Avideo - they were in php and they were, so we liked them that they were in php. But at that time there were no special competitors, now I have looked at a lot of applications. That is, if Avideo doesn’t work for us, we can try someone else, but this is naturally the next stage, it’s not at this stage, at this stage we at least need a kind of stable conference at least on Jitsi.

And what have you heard of an interesting application. I don't remember, I usually go to this AlternativeTo I like this resource

that is, they basically have this Kanter or how she is there, she also compares something. But this is what I usually use.

I'm in the chat right now

They give, as it were, you can immediately choose open source

[music]

Yes

they are still here under the old name. maybe they are not new, and well, in principle, it is, as it were, historically, and the video is now they are doing the rebranding themselves, but historically they were called YouPHPTube stably.

I choose allow

it turns out even vimeo, does it turn out similar?

Well, yes, but they all have their own characteristics

there is one peertube they have generally interesting ideas they

on several, that is, they are, as it were, on several independent networks, and it turns out that they are, as it were, well, an interesting idea

this is the principle at the moment, but you can choose to take let's say who to look for and we can choose, for example, only Open Source, for example

now I'm sharing

Already exactly, as it were, well, that is, with a choice

and you can choose let's say only there PHP there or something else

and accordingly, now they give only those that are Open Source

media Goblin someone praised me, but it's a long time ago, but they don't have as many as these.

I will directly write down, to be honest, I have not heard such a wonderful resource.

AlternativeTo?

This is my main

I think the conference will end now, I'll lose the link, don't

I look at this BuiltWith, for example, they give me statistics and how much physically now, well, that is, I use Google Trends, I see how often people ask something, by the number exactly how much this BuiltWith costs, they show how many percentage of sites they use they are, well, judging by their popularity

Well, yes, and I use AlternativeTo to search for options

so I want to ask if we can make Avideo the topic of conversation there for the next meeting, or until we solve all the problems with Jitsi, how would we leave this topic? If you organize, if you coordinate a meeting of our council, then you decide, in principle, you can ask Natalia or me, but there must be some kind of agenda,

you are preparing a meeting of a technical council or a technology council, as we called it, a technology council and, accordingly, the topics can be any topical ones that we will consider. Then, after some time, of course, we will arrange our applications, we will periodically do them as a periodic review as an inspection inspection review Well, yes, a review.

and but I don’t know the topics at the moment, any topics, everything related to technology, at the moment we have two very hot problems - these are Jitsi with video, not even Jitsi, but let's call it video conferences, starting with Jitsi and the second is mediawiki starting with LDAP. But in general, we have a lot of problems, in general we have a lot of problems, there are a lot of problems Oplet, with LDAP we want to jump out to wso2

We need to look at our cluster that Muhammad did,

also urgent by the way, three urgent issues, because the cluster is about Jitsi

But we haven’t talked about wikis in principle yet, we can start a series about wikis

You talk about the Guided Tour, it's gone, finished

Guided Tour, we made a prototype, the prototype suits me, I like it, but we didn’t find an option how to translate it into English, if we don’t have working options for translating it into English, we can’t sell it, then we need to do something else, that is, here at the moment for me the Guided Tour is just kind of okay

a stopped project, that is, we tried it, we got it, we liked the prototype, but the question is how to move it further how to do it

like this Well, what else is there a topic or so it's normal, calmly, well, in a family way. I like this option. Then it turns out that these meetings will be, the main goal is to discuss current problems, current technical problems, what we do where we want projects to move.

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